The case for holy war
4/20/202624 min
The Secretary of Defense suggests the Iran war is blessed by God. The head of his church, Pastor Doug Wilson, agrees. Some call Wilson an extremist. He prefers Christian nationalist. Either way, he's no longer a fringe figure. This episode was produced by Hady Mawajdeh, edited by Jolie Myers, fact-checked by Gabriel Dunatov, engineered by David Tatasciore, and hosted by Noel King. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth at the Pentagon. Photo by Alex Wong/Getty Images. Listen to Today, Explained ad-free by becoming a Vox Member: vox.com/members. New Vox members get $20 off their membership right now. Transcript at vox.com/today-explained-podcast. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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Transcript preview
First 90 secondsNoel King· Host0:00
[upbeat music] Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth has been talking about the war in Iran in distinctly biblical terms, citing Psalms, the resurrection of Jesus, and the Book of Quentin.
Speaker 1· Soundbite0:11
And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to capture and destroy my brother.
Noel King· Host0:18
President Trump is comparing himself to Christ. Vice President Vance is fighting with the Pope. Watching all of this is the increasingly influential Pastor Doug Wilson. He co-founded the church that Hegseth attends. Wilson's a Christian nationalist who would like the USA to be a theocracy. He'd also like to help us get there, though he doesn't think it's gonna happen any time soon.
Doug Wilson· Guest0:38
I believe that it is accelerating. I believe that we're making significant gains. I see us assembling resources, and I'm encouraged in that labor. But I don't expect to see what we're praying for in my lifetime.
Noel King· Host0:52
Pastor Doug Wilson and how much you should worry about his plans, coming up on Today, Explained from Vox.
Doug Wilson· Guest0:58
[upbeat music] This is Today, Explained. My name is Douglas James Wilson. I'm the senior pastor at Christ Church in Moscow, Idaho. So I'm a pastor and I'm a writer.
Noel King· Host1:13
Pastor Wilson, I've heard you say that you are okay being called a Christian nationalist.
Doug Wilson· Guest1:19
Yes.
Noel King· Host1:19
Do I have that right?
Doug Wilson· Guest1:20
Right. I'm, I'm okay with it. It's not a term that I would've picked off the menu myself, um, but when it was assigned to us, I,