Keir Starmer: the end game
5/12/202637 min
An extraordinary day in British politics: Keir Starmer vows to fight on, but the resignations keep on coming. How long can the prime minister survive? What's next, and who will move first? Wes Streeting has one shot: will he take it? What is Andy Burnham's plan?
Recorded at Temple Church as part of the Fleet Street Quarter Festival of Words.
Steven Swinford, political editor, The Times
Patrick Maguire, chief political commentator, The Times
Gabriel Pogrund, editor of Insight, The Sunday Times
Producers: Euan Dawtrey, Harry Kitson
Executive producer: Molly Guinness
Picture credit: Getty Images
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Transcript preview
First 90 secondsSteven Swinford· Host0:00
[upbeat music] Welcome to The State of It, this live recording of the political podcast from The Times and the Sunday Times. I am Stephen Swinford, the political editor of The Times.
Patrick Maguire· Host0:07
Uh, I'm Patrick McHugh, chief political commentator for The Times.
Gabriel Pogrund· Host0:10
And I'm Gabriel Pogrund, um, editor of Insight, The Sunday Times investigations team.
Steven Swinford· Host0:16
Hear, hear. Newly promoted.
Gabriel Pogrund· Host0:17
Yeah.
Steven Swinford· Host0:17
Congratulations, Gabriel. Um, we, uh, come to you at yet another extraordinary juncture in British politics. Uh, I, I kind of think it will never happen again, and then it happens again. So, uh, we just had a cabinet where Keir Starmer has essentially sent a message to his cabinet of, "Put up or shut up." And he has issued a direct challenge at that cabinet that essentially, in his words, there's a process, and if you wanna trigger that process, there's a way of doing it. It's essentially, and this is my words not his, "Come and have a go if you think you're hard enough." And that message is aimed at Wes Streeting, the health secretary, and also others around that table that are backing Andy Burnham. And there's one question that really matters, and I'm gonna direct this to Patrick and cop out entirely in this moment from answering it. Is there any way that Keir Starmer can survive this, Patrick?
Patrick Maguire· Host1:06
I think he can survive the day and maybe even the next 48 hours, but I was saying to somebody yesterday that we were always going to end up here this morning, which is a 24 to 48-hour period in which Keir Starmer denies the political reality unfolding in front of him, and that's exactly where we are. I was speaking to one of